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My Views (PvP changes and the growth of UO:F)

Discussion in 'Suggestions & Ideas' started by Winstonian, Nov 23, 2019.

  1. Winstonian

    Winstonian Well-Known Member

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    1. My Perspective

    Let me start by saying that UO is and will always be my favorite game, and that UO:F is - by far - the best version of that game.

    It's also important to note that this current version of the game isn't exactly what it used to be, in many cases for the better. One clear example: the PvM here is remarkable, and attracts both PvMers and PvPers to participate. One way in which UO:F lags behind is not (necessarily) in the amount of PvP, but the accessibility of PvP to the general population.

    In its prime, PvP was centered about build diversity, preparation, timely heals and overall tactics. The casual player could (and often did) grab a few cure potions and jump into the fray, enjoying the excitement and tension of the best gameplay that UO had to offer. That environment, quite frankly, no longer exists.

    UO:F PvP has devolved into meta builds, group tactics and automated actions. If you don't run the right build and utilize the right mechanics (expl pots for one), or don't have 9 others with you ready to cast the same spell on the same target, you don't stand a chance against those that do. And that's completely fine: there are those that love this style of play, and they will continue to participate until pulled away by the next big game.

    This, however, wont lead to the growth of this game. UO thrives when most of its players are both consumed by the PvM and enjoy the thrill of PvP, not aiming to avoid it completely. This can only be achieved by diversifying UO:F PvP. In my opinion, this isn't difficult to do.

    2. The Approach

    I believe it's imperative that we enhance certain skills and balance others to provide for an increase in viable PvP builds. As it stands right now, there are five skills 'required' for mage PvP:

    Resist
    Evaluating Intellect
    Meditation
    Magery
    Wrestling/Anatomy

    It's my belief that UO:F needs to tinker with those remaining two spots to allow the player to determine how they'd like to play, and to have each playstyle be equally effective. Examples: Want to throw expl potions? Good. Require GM Alchemy (potion damage) and Tactics (remove splash) to make this build viable. Prefer a more defensive style? Invest in Inscription (spell reflection, protection or reactive armor) and Healing. Enhance Poisoning to deal significantly more damage and to cause the Cure spell or cure potions to have a chance to fail. And, of course, Wrestling and Anatomy allow the player to stun. Once balanced, these changes would significantly diversify mage PvP, removing a true 'meta' build and instead allowing players to choose (and enjoy) their own preferred style. This doesn't mention uoforever builds, which, in turn, may also see increased play.

    In addition, I believe that other changes are also worth exploring. For one, Archery needs to be a viable skill: whether that means reducing the chance to miss at GM, or allowing arrows to be shot while moving, it's important that Archery is effective. In addition, I also feel that it's worth thinking outside the box to 'fix' some of the more... lame... strategies. I do feel that there should be some sort of 'diminishing returns' to being struck by 10 e-bolts at once. (The first does full damage, while the damage of the second and subsequent cast within two seconds is reduced considerably.) Instead of spamming the same spell together, they'd have to at least discuss and decide which different spells to cast. It ain't much, but it's honest work.

    3. The Bottom Line

    UO:F is a truly great version of what I feel is the best game of all time. That being said, unless and until PvP is tweaked to appeal to the masses and not the few, it will struggle to grow in the way that it should. The hardcore PvPers will just say "get gud" or "stop crying and adapt", and that's absolutely fine... players will leave and find PvP elsewhere. For this game to truly grow, PvP has to appeal to all, not the few.
     
  2. Peav

    Peav Well-Known Member

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    PvP population is in the minority of UOF. I think it's not useful for the server to cater changes around skills etc on a fundamental system that always worked. Looking back at servers history, I think everybody has to admit that the transitioning from PvP changes which @Blair was managing to the PvM based sequel of new relics and usefulness of powerscrolls really spiked up in the non-toxic community that @Shane has been working with was really the edge that the server has been missing, you can clearly see the upcoming new visible players after every single donation update and majority of players willingly farm and a lot of traffic on the buy-selling channel.

    In my honest opinion, UOF should cater towards the direction it's been going towards and clearly succeeding and evaluate PvP mechanics and changes less frequently because of the interest people don't give it much towards.

    Hope you all stand by my words and clearly see the pattern,
    Have a good day.
     
    lollo likes this.
  3. eric_azria

    eric_azria Well-Known Member

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    I agree with Peav.

    I said it many times, but Trammel should have been introduced long ago. I think that's the key to UO's future.
     
  4. Lexington

    Lexington Well-Known Member

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    Who are you and what guild are you with?
     
  5. Winstonian

    Winstonian Well-Known Member

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    Reasonable, but isn't it possible that lack of interest in PvP is a reflection of the current PvP mechanics? If field PvP was 'fun', I believe that far more players would participate.
     
  6. Winstonian

    Winstonian Well-Known Member

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    I've played here, on and off, since 2014. Since I've always preferred PvP, I tend to come back only to be reminded how bland and uninteresting PvP has become.

    But, honestly, I'm not sure what this has to do with my overall point. A few things are true: the majority of players avoid PvP, some mechanics clearly function differently here than they used to, and there's a clear-cut 'meta' mage PvP build. I strongly believe that, if you tinker with points 2 and 3, you'll find a shift in point 1.
     
  7. Lexington

    Lexington Well-Known Member

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    Who you are has everything to do with your point. There have been so many come here to criticize UOF and UOF PVP that have no experience with it once so ever. That's why I asked who you are and what guild you are with. Validation for your points.
     
  8. Winstonian

    Winstonian Well-Known Member

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    At the same time, someone that comes here and hates the PvP won't stick around, so only allowing the "dedicated" PvPers to have an opinion won't fix the issue. We need to discuss ideas and suggestions on their merits alone.
     
  9. drasked

    drasked Well-Known Member

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    Write down something balanced then. Just saying some random stuff followed by "once balanced" isn't helping your case.
     
    BakedDaily likes this.
  10. Winstonian

    Winstonian Well-Known Member

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    ... you want me to create my own UO shard, find a way to code these changes to exactly what UO:F is running and find a bunch of players that would want to test them?

    Isn't it easier to just discuss the suggestion? The obvious truth that diversifying PvP would make it far more interesting to players that don't currently participate?
     
  11. K A Z

    K A Z Well-Known Member

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    i kinda feel like we already have all of this?? We have alchymages, we have scribemages and we have healmages. We have tank mages. We even have tank mages with archery (and they are actually pretty useful??) Is your problem with everyone being able to stun, or..?

    Not sure about "diminishing returns" but it seems to be silly that out of a sudden a guy should survive an ebolt rail just because.. it's somehow unfair? Not sure if it is, really.. just a (sometimes very lame) feature of a MMORPG. The more the better! Numbers win (and in UO they dont always and necessarily!!!)

    a good start for more PVP would be to get rid of overland PK statloss and to bring back IDOCs. IDOCs give a log of initiative for PVP and trammies love it.

    You heard it here first!!!
     
    BakedDaily likes this.
  12. Winstonian

    Winstonian Well-Known Member

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    The majority of PvPers have conceded that there's a clear meta mage build for PvP. Just because a few use other builds for other situations doesn't mean that they're balanced, and other skills (poisoning, for one) absolutely need to be made viable.

    But, of course, this has quite a bit to do with expl potions. As many have said, if you don't throw them, you don't stand a chance. Keep expl potions, but require 200 skill points to make them viable.

    Again, these are suggestions that will greatly increase the interest in PvP from those that seek to avoid PvP. I don't expect the potion-throwing, meta build using PvPers to agree, but it's absolutely worth exploring for the health of the shard.
     
  13. Winstonian

    Winstonian Well-Known Member

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    I forgot to respond to this.

    Numbers would still win. It would just require the group to cast more than one spell, which benefits everyone. The group still has a clear advantage.
     
  14. K A Z

    K A Z Well-Known Member

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    okay! I wish you all the best in your endeavors!
     
  15. drasked

    drasked Well-Known Member

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    Start by writing something concrete and coherent. Your OP is just a soup of random ideas.

    For example your idea of explo pots needing alchemy and tactics. This would nerf alchy mages but leave alchy dexers intact, even tho alchy dexers are already the strongest and easiest template to play 1vX. But nobody in their right mind would spend 100 skillpoints just to remove the splash damage from explo pots. So in essence all we are doing is removing the splash damage from explo pots for dexers based on one of their main skills, tactics. You see how that is problematic?
     
  16. Winstonian

    Winstonian Well-Known Member

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    Without balancing, sure. Which is how this stuff works: you make changes, then you balance things.

    Of course, you could require two empty hands to throw potions, which would force dexers to drop their weapon(s) to throw. (Balancing.)

    I understand that the PvPers dislike any suggestions that might change their beloved mage pot-throwing, but there's a reason why new players come here, see the PvP and find another game to play. Adding other equal mage builds to the mix will only help UO:F grow.
     
  17. BakedDaily

    BakedDaily Well-Known Member

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    There will always be something wrong with balancing pvp,every shard I ever played someone has to complain about something.The only thing I think they need to change.ia the stat loss personally and you'll see alot more pks.
     
  18. lollo

    lollo Well-Known Member

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    RunYourDead / GoogleMyName / Superlollo / a wandering dealer
    TL;DR: a cry post about explo pots.

    God did I miss these, I hope it's the first step towards a 2014 UOF renaissance
     
    K A Z likes this.
  19. lollo

    lollo Well-Known Member

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    RunYourDead / GoogleMyName / Superlollo / a wandering dealer
    stat loss is already pretty tame on this server, there's really no need to change anything. Just build more PKs and you'll never be unable to play one. Making a 7x gm char on this server is so easy and cheap there's really no reason NOT to have 6+ pks if that's your play style. We also have no-cut area around brit, yet I don't see all that many reds there
     
  20. lollo

    lollo Well-Known Member

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    RunYourDead / GoogleMyName / Superlollo / a wandering dealer
    Yeah it's a triple post fuck that: everything went downhill after EQMS and $ got banned. So basically the guilds that everyone appointed as toxic were the ones keeping the server healthy. Try to dispute this.
     

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